X Nations - View Single Post - Hungryman, another year and you haven't paid your debt

03-10-2004, 05:19 AM

Unless I was completely fooled on Hungryman's character, here's my opinion on your letter:

It is my opinion that this letter of yours was very unwise...

Hungryman was so slimed on GFY by Vid that he's lost at least 75% of all of his revenues. It did not dawn on him, I surmise because of THC-induced neuronal slowdown, that if he destroyed Hungryman's revenue base, how would Hungry be able to repay anything back ?

But AFAIK, he did know that there was in fact no true significant debt, so it was really a vicious attack. He claimed a debt for an old VCR that he's GIVEN to him. He claimed monies for the cleaning lady, but that's about all. I guesstimate the value at 200 bucks or less. Yet, IMHO, what Vid did to Hungryman was enough to justify a major lawsuit...

And again, at this very moment, he's being attacked for God knows what sake on GFY (maybe you're leading the jihad?) , while his IP address has been blocked, therefore preventing him to defend himself. If I were him (and had money), I'd sue GFY and the slimers into friggin oblivion.

I know Hungry rather well. He's got his idiosyncratic character but he's a darn hard worker and people who are doing business with him knows that he DELIVERS the work. He's doing work for big players, but IMHO, he does not charge enough for his service AND he's too perfectionist, so he ends up working for a rather low hourly rate. Of course, his clients are ecstatic, but that doesn't make him rich...

Accessorily, he also got fleeced a few times for contracts he's done since last summer, but in these cases, it's much less pardonable because those people HAD money. Did he go on the board to whine to the world ? Nope.

Remember the old saying: what goes around comes around. Sometimes, the route goodwill takes is rather long and circuitous...

I am not aware of the minutiae of his business but I can tell you that he's been working darn hard to get himself out of the shit hole people with big ego and little brain put him into...

After a year, I suggest you not cut but rather postpone your losses. From what I know from him, and I've got to know him a lot, I think that he'll eventually make good on all his true debts.

While I agree that it might be proper to warn people not to do work for him, because of his hypothetical difficulty to make payments (just ask C.O.D.), I find it very unwise of you to discourage people to do business at all with him. He can be accused of many things, but not of being a con man and not honouring his commitments makes him deeply unhappy.

Beside, with respect to sliming him, if he doesn't get any clients because of your intervention, how do you expect him to pay you back ?

That's a real no-brainer !

The only plausible explanation to your ranting, because I refuse to ascribe sheer malice or stupidity to you, is that you probably think he's got money coming out of his ears and that he's dishonouring his commitments and that by shaming him in public, you'll entice him to pay.

But if you mis-calculated, the odds are that this will backfire against you... If you don't know the exact state of his finances, it would be wise to be cautious before undermining his ability to pay you back.

(I'm not questionning the alledged debt here. Maybe it is questionnable but I take your word for it, for the moment)

Just for entertainment, let me remind you of a few facts about his last year's business...

He spent six months of his life putting up the Webmaster's summit and got zilch out of it. He moved to Montreal with Vid and eventually, Vid backed out of their mutual projects. Apparently, Vid sucked up his knowledge, learned web design from Paul and then, when he got what he wanted, he dropped him.

Then, for highly dubious reasons, Vid slandered him over an alledged debt for a server that Vid himself owned, i.e. Vid blamed Hungryman for Vid's wrong decisions and failure to take responsibility for his own actions and claimed an imaginary debt. Then, Hungry had to move out from Vid's.

Then, later on, he was barred from participating in organising the Webmaster's summit in Vancouver, where he could hypothetically have recouped his losses. BTW, Toronto's Webmaster's summit was below par because the only guy who did significant work was him, his alledged partners being all talk and no action.

So, as I said, I suggest you postpone your losses.

As to him clearing his debts, future will tell, but I trust his character 100%.

Oh, and another thing: who do you think he'll re-imburse first? The people who preserved good relationship with him and backed him nothwithstanding his difficulties or the ones who slandered him on public forums, causing dammages to the core of his business and with/for whom he's got nothing to gain by re-imbursing because the dammage was already done to his reputation ?

That's another double-dip no-brainer...

I suggest you read the Sun Tzu (aka The Art of War, written 2400 years ago); It's a must-read for any head of corporation who want to learn about conflict management and resolution and ensuring victory...

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...glance&s=books

Feel free to think whatever you wish about my abovestated opinion, I'll fight to defend your right to think that I'm an utter idiot.

03-10-2004, 05:19 AM	#5
Feynman Feynman should edit this Edit Guest Posts: n/a xBucks: 0 [Check]	Unless I was completely fooled on Hungryman's character, here's my opinion on your letter: It is my opinion that this letter of yours was very unwise... Hungryman was so slimed on GFY by Vid that he's lost at least 75% of all of his revenues. It did not dawn on him, I surmise because of THC-induced neuronal slowdown, that if he destroyed Hungryman's revenue base, how would Hungry be able to repay anything back ? But AFAIK, he did know that there was in fact no true significant debt, so it was really a vicious attack. He claimed a debt for an old VCR that he's GIVEN to him. He claimed monies for the cleaning lady, but that's about all. I guesstimate the value at 200 bucks or less. Yet, IMHO, what Vid did to Hungryman was enough to justify a major lawsuit... And again, at this very moment, he's being attacked for God knows what sake on GFY (maybe you're leading the jihad?) , while his IP address has been blocked, therefore preventing him to defend himself. If I were him (and had money), I'd sue GFY and the slimers into friggin oblivion. I know Hungry rather well. He's got his idiosyncratic character but he's a darn hard worker and people who are doing business with him knows that he DELIVERS the work. He's doing work for big players, but IMHO, he does not charge enough for his service AND he's too perfectionist, so he ends up working for a rather low hourly rate. Of course, his clients are ecstatic, but that doesn't make him rich... Accessorily, he also got fleeced a few times for contracts he's done since last summer, but in these cases, it's much less pardonable because those people HAD money. Did he go on the board to whine to the world ? Nope. Remember the old saying: what goes around comes around. Sometimes, the route goodwill takes is rather long and circuitous... I am not aware of the minutiae of his business but I can tell you that he's been working darn hard to get himself out of the shit hole people with big ego and little brain put him into... After a year, I suggest you not cut but rather postpone your losses. From what I know from him, and I've got to know him a lot, I think that he'll eventually make good on all his true debts. While I agree that it might be proper to warn people not to do work for him, because of his hypothetical difficulty to make payments (just ask C.O.D.), I find it very unwise of you to discourage people to do business at all with him. He can be accused of many things, but not of being a con man and not honouring his commitments makes him deeply unhappy. Beside, with respect to sliming him, if he doesn't get any clients because of your intervention, how do you expect him to pay you back ? That's a real no-brainer ! The only plausible explanation to your ranting, because I refuse to ascribe sheer malice or stupidity to you, is that you probably think he's got money coming out of his ears and that he's dishonouring his commitments and that by shaming him in public, you'll entice him to pay. But if you mis-calculated, the odds are that this will backfire against you... If you don't know the exact state of his finances, it would be wise to be cautious before undermining his ability to pay you back. (I'm not questionning the alledged debt here. Maybe it is questionnable but I take your word for it, for the moment) Just for entertainment, let me remind you of a few facts about his last year's business... He spent six months of his life putting up the Webmaster's summit and got zilch out of it. He moved to Montreal with Vid and eventually, Vid backed out of their mutual projects. Apparently, Vid sucked up his knowledge, learned web design from Paul and then, when he got what he wanted, he dropped him. Then, for highly dubious reasons, Vid slandered him over an alledged debt for a server that Vid himself owned, i.e. Vid blamed Hungryman for Vid's wrong decisions and failure to take responsibility for his own actions and claimed an imaginary debt. Then, Hungry had to move out from Vid's. Then, later on, he was barred from participating in organising the Webmaster's summit in Vancouver, where he could hypothetically have recouped his losses. BTW, Toronto's Webmaster's summit was below par because the only guy who did significant work was him, his alledged partners being all talk and no action. So, as I said, I suggest you postpone your losses. As to him clearing his debts, future will tell, but I trust his character 100%. Oh, and another thing: who do you think he'll re-imburse first? The people who preserved good relationship with him and backed him nothwithstanding his difficulties or the ones who slandered him on public forums, causing dammages to the core of his business and with/for whom he's got nothing to gain by re-imbursing because the dammage was already done to his reputation ? That's another double-dip no-brainer... I suggest you read the Sun Tzu (aka The Art of War, written 2400 years ago); It's a must-read for any head of corporation who want to learn about conflict management and resolution and ensuring victory... http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...glance&s=books Feel free to think whatever you wish about my abovestated opinion, I'll fight to defend your right to think that I'm an utter idiot.